Odd ball target breaks

Discussion in 'Trapshooting Forum - Americantrapshooter.com' started by 635 G, Jul 29, 2020.

  1. 635 G

    635 G Mega Poster

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    Went to a local trap field to try something new this morning-- Very cloudy No Sun @ all.

    Tried clear lenses. hit everything hard- Now the oddball observation

    pieces were flying in distances that cover the distances from the hard right to the hard left.

    Targets were WF AA trap targets--ammo B&P Comp 1--1 oz 71/2 @1160

    Gun Infinity -,025 Briley thin wall

    Trap--Promatic

    Never have seen pieces spread that far with starburst hits
     
  2. Rufus T. Firefly

    Rufus T. Firefly Active Member

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    You hit it didn’t you?
     
  3. wpt

    wpt Forum Leader Founding Member Forum Leader

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    Must be them new and improved WF targets ... WPT ... (YAC) ...
     
  4. 635 G

    635 G Mega Poster

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    Was thinking if they're the new & improved--what a PIA--with all those pieces spreading over adjacent fields as a shooter calls for a target
     
  5. Roger Coveleskie

    Roger Coveleskie Ultra Elite Poster Founding Member

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    They may be bio targets. They do no roll up into a black ball. Ask the club manager what they are. Roger C.
     
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  6. Troutbum

    Troutbum Active Member

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    I tend to agree with Roger. We shoot bio targets and last week I had a couple that when hit exploded and spread across the entire field much like fireworks.
     
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  7. rookieshooter

    rookieshooter Elite Poster Forum Leader

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    Does not exactly boost ones confidence level.
     
  8. 635 G

    635 G Mega Poster

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    Yes Roger, nothing on the box says 'BIO" but they say to store in a cool dry place--yeh right in a Florida trap house-must be Bios---BIOS are moisture sponges and they get soft, thats why no good breaks--Lawry's @ RR put these WF's to shame @ least I can make them vanish
     
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  9. Roger Coveleskie

    Roger Coveleskie Ultra Elite Poster Founding Member

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    Pitch targets are not bothered by humidity very much. Bio's suck wet or dry. Roger C.
     
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  10. trapshooter47

    trapshooter47 Mega Poster Founding Member

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    The White Flyer bio’s I’ve seen says Biodegradable in big letters on top of the box.
     
  11. 635 G

    635 G Mega Poster

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    Absolutely no mention of Biodegradeable on the box !!!!
     
  12. Roger Coveleskie

    Roger Coveleskie Ultra Elite Poster Founding Member

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    I have seen pitch target floating in water that were no affected. I also have seen them melt in the Arizona sun. Roger C.
    They are like knuckle balls as wet target will not spin off of the arm.
     
    Last edited: Aug 2, 2020
  13. trapshooter47

    trapshooter47 Mega Poster Founding Member

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    635 then how do you know if they are Bio or Pitch?
     
  14. Roger Coveleskie

    Roger Coveleskie Ultra Elite Poster Founding Member

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    Bio's are not black under neath. No black smoke when hit hard. white smoke only. No black rim on bios. Roger C.
     
  15. 635 G

    635 G Mega Poster

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    These are solid Green, for the lousy back ground--mostly trees and green, with very little sky
     
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  16. Roger Coveleskie

    Roger Coveleskie Ultra Elite Poster Founding Member

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    Bio's are always solid colors. Turn one over what color do you see? Roger C.
     
  17. trapshooter47

    trapshooter47 Mega Poster Founding Member

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    Is the top of the target slotted or dimpled? WF website says all bio targets are slotted.
     
  18. 635 G

    635 G Mega Poster

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    Dimpled--
     
  19. trapshooter47

    trapshooter47 Mega Poster Founding Member

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    They are pitch targets according to White Flyers website.
     
  20. Roger Coveleskie

    Roger Coveleskie Ultra Elite Poster Founding Member

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    If those targets were as soft as you say they were they would not have cycled through any automatic target machine. No mater what they were made of. It may be an info error. I worked with machines and targets for over 30 yrs. Heard more imagined problems with both that I could fill a very large book with them.
    I will agree bio targets suck. They give of a dust that turns to goo like cement when humidity gets high. The motors suck that junk in then burn out. I could not keep motors in stock for WIN. skeet machines when the bio's first cam out.
    Roger C.
     
    Last edited: Aug 8, 2020
  21. History Seeker

    History Seeker A NoBody Official Historian Founding Member

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    635G,

    I would like to know, have they RESET that cheap assed trap to toss the lighter WF targets yet ?

    I have to say that the (Cheapest TRAP thrower Pro-Matic offers) Pro-Matic was tossing targets worse than anything I ever saw.

    HIGH, LOW, Flippers, you never knew what you were going to get.

    They originally had it set for the heavy Sporting Clays targets, I'm no expert, but I would have to think they needed to reset the trap to throw these new ones correctly.

    Could it be the trap is throwing the lighter targets faster now, and that is why pieces are flying so far ?

    At the rate that club is going, I would be real surprised if the owner ever put's in a second field.

    He sure has been dragging his feet accommodating the Trap and skeet guys who put up most of the monies for that field.

    World Class Sporting, 5 stand, and other accommodations. Skeet and Trap, well we are taking the back seat so far at that club for sure.

    See you in the Fall, if they ever get the fields running right.

    It is a shame since it is so close to home, yet still the same problems exist.
     
  22. 635 G

    635 G Mega Poster

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    So right, a 15 minute trip vs an hour and 15 minutes--will have to wait till a bud shows up with a real radar gun--also some of the targets are being stored in a damp wet floor in the trap house--looks like they will never throw any registered at this point
     
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  23. History Seeker

    History Seeker A NoBody Official Historian Founding Member

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    With that trap that can't throw doubles, and you have to use wrenches to reset target heights, NO handwheel for elevation.

    I cannot see the ATA delegate approving that field at all.

    A shame that this club cannot get the ball rolling and do things right for the Trap and Skeet shooters.

    Promatic Matrix ATA, their Cheapest trap and it throws like one.
     
  24. nickthanos

    nickthanos Member

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    What was your score? That's all that matters. Some of the clubs in our area (west bend, wi) throw bios. Never had a problem. They blow up just fine. White smoke instead of black.
     
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  25. 635 G

    635 G Mega Poster

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    I have never shot for score @ this range--I invested a lot of $$ to get the range built--with the hope it would be a good ATA venue; however ,the owner/builder has not been up to the task--currently the only thing I do @ it is drill & honestly its been screwing up my game instead of helping it-- green targets, lousy background and who knows what the targets are doing--zero consistency
     
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  26. History Seeker

    History Seeker A NoBody Official Historian Founding Member

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    FACT for the readers:

    Phil (635G) did indeed pony up a LOT of money to get this range going because it is so close to where he lives, and one of his requests was to install a Pat Trap of which only a SMALL portion of his donation would have had to be used..

    The owner only had to have the fields built, and install what was asked for by a MAJOR investor, and others who donated money for this operation.

    Little to no money had to come from the owner.

    Sad they got little in return.

    Thanks for trying Phil. Someday things may get better. We can only hope.
     
  27. 635 G

    635 G Mega Poster

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    Thanx wanted a Pat Trap with wireless BRB voice calls-so far got a garbage Promatic Matrix and hand pulls--got it in writing--but being told its a work in progress

    They hare supposed to have the Fl sporting clays state shoot in Dec.--it would behoove them to get the "dump" cleaned up and truly functional
     
  28. History Seeker

    History Seeker A NoBody Official Historian Founding Member

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    The voice calls sit in the skeet houses. I was told they don't know how to wire them into this Pro-Matic trap.

    Must be rocket science and I guess they cannot call Pro-Matic for instructions.

    Did they landscape that combination field yet, or are you still wallowing in the mud ?

    I have heard that Work in Progress excuse since they told us they would be finished in October of 2019.

    Then I was told by the gal at the counter (No longer there) that they needed to wait for more donations.

    Tons of excuses for what could have been a first class trap & skeet operation like the rest of the Sporting Clays and 5 stand are.

    The 5 stand is wonderful

    Blackjack.jpg
     
  29. 635 G

    635 G Mega Poster

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    The voice calls will work, but management wants a Point of Sale card system similar to what they use on the sporting courses, before they will let shooters use them

    Went there this morning--breaks improved, inspected the targets they were and are WF pitch- black bottoms, big problems when they store them on the wet ground in the house
     
  30. History Seeker

    History Seeker A NoBody Official Historian Founding Member

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    Amazed they didn't have them up on a pallet or something.

    Not geared toward the Trap guys at all.

    They already have someone there to take our $8.00 tokens, so I don't see the need for point of sale.

    Another excuse I guess.
     
  31. trapshooter47

    trapshooter47 Mega Poster Founding Member

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    Our trap houses sweat bad, we put pallets on the floors to keep the boxes on. The boxes still get soft from moisture but doesn’t bother the targets. We have all Pat Trap machines and use BRB Wireless systems and throw WF Pitch targets. I think we have a great setup.
     
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  32. Roger Coveleskie

    Roger Coveleskie Ultra Elite Poster Founding Member

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    If the targets are wet they will not spin off of the arm. This causes bad breaks and no breaks. Targets and arm material must be dry. Roger C.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Aug 20, 2020
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  33. 635 G

    635 G Mega Poster

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    I'm totally envious--right now all I do is drill on the field--25 targets per post. until it gets to f---ing hot star @ 9am--usually out of there b
     
  34. 635 G

    635 G Mega Poster

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    Thanx --Roger--never thought about moisture on the targets or the trap arms
     
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  35. History Seeker

    History Seeker A NoBody Official Historian Founding Member

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    Roger, You probably explained the Flippers, and erratic targets.

    Too bad everything they have for power is 12VDC or they could at lest put a fan in the house to help keep things a little drier.

    Sad situation at the moment.
     
  36. Roger Coveleskie

    Roger Coveleskie Ultra Elite Poster Founding Member

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    They will never throw good consistant targets with a battery operated machine. When the power drops so does the target presentation. They will loose more target money than it would have cost to run elecricity to the field. Ben Avery tried battery machines and never made it through their first regisrered event. That is a mistake made by people that have never operated a comercial trap club. Roger C.
     
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  37. trapshooter47

    trapshooter47 Mega Poster Founding Member

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    I don’t think I would invest anymore of my money or time into that place. What a let down for the Trap community. Our club had a 5 stand setup that was 12volt, we used deep cycle marine batteries and solar charges, Junk setup from the start! Never worked right. We opted to sell all the machines and solar crap and lost money to get rid of it. Ty from Ky
     
  38. 635 G

    635 G Mega Poster

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    They have 120v in the trap house--the machine comes with a 12 v transformer, looks like I have to reach into my wallet again and tell the owner, to get a real trap machine --PAT TRAP--this crap is getting old --fast--I'm fortunate enough @ my age $$ is the least of my worries--every day I waste , trying to shoot @ lousy targets really pisses me off--the same goes for any club that doesn't give a damn about its patrons/members--shooting @ different backgrounds, with different color targets is not helping my game
     
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  39. History Seeker

    History Seeker A NoBody Official Historian Founding Member

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    And when the owner of this club came looking for donations, he certainly gave us a presentation of the whole operation for skeet and trap up and running first class in October of 2019.

    What a bunch of crapola that was !

    For some reason, I held back putting more than $250.00 into his pocket. At least I got some $8.00 tokens out of it.

    I have to admit, it is great for Wobble Trap practice but that is all.
     
  40. trapshooter47

    trapshooter47 Mega Poster Founding Member

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    Money may not be a worry, but throwing good money at a place that obviously doesn’t care about Trap shooters can’t be a good investment.
     
  41. 635 G

    635 G Mega Poster

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    I don't look @ it as an investment, I want it to be a training aid for me & thats all I want it to be--I don't shoot doubles, but I want a good singles and handicap presentation- so I can build up my eye/muscle memory so I can break a couple of good scores when it counts-I like to drill & not shoot B/S games
     
  42. trapshooter47

    trapshooter47 Mega Poster Founding Member

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    I understand, I don’t shoot doubles either. I’m fortunate to have a couple good clubs with good members who will listen to input from members. The club I’m Vice President at is not all about the “money”. We want to throw the best possible target for the shooters. Pat Traps can be a pain in the ass but if you keep the maintenance up on them they work. Maybe if enough shooters got together and voiced their displeasure with what’s happening and locked up their pockets something would change.
     
  43. david j burke

    david j burke Member

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    Bet you can't break a bronze "clay" bronze clay.JPG
     
  44. 635 G

    635 G Mega Poster

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    The trouble in Fl is most "clubs" are businesses and the other real clubs are controlled by the majority of shooters, who in most cases are not trap shooters

    There are only 300 Florida ATA members--its a tough state to shoot in
     
  45. oleolliedawg

    oleolliedawg Elite Poster Staff Member Founding Member

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    Promatics? My conscience still bothers me a bit for buying 4 hardly used Superstar traps for a grand total of $2,000-CASH- from a club that bit into the "we must have PAT traps" from a few of their members.
     
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  46. 635 G

    635 G Mega Poster

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    If I remember Superstars threw great targets, especially doubles
     
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  47. Roger Coveleskie

    Roger Coveleskie Ultra Elite Poster Founding Member

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    Oleolliedawg, That was the deal of a life time. That was the best trap machine ever on the market by far. The only machine that came close to the S.S. doubles presentation was the Remington doubles made by Parker Boss in Kansas.
    Roger C.
     
    Last edited: Aug 8, 2020
  48. oleolliedawg

    oleolliedawg Elite Poster Staff Member Founding Member

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    Yes it was. That club burned to the ground shortly after I did that deal. Good timing!
     
  49. Roger Coveleskie

    Roger Coveleskie Ultra Elite Poster Founding Member

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    Rod Shyda was #1 and I was #2 in super Star sales in the USA. It's a shame they will no longer sell in the USA. Roger C.
     
  50. History Seeker

    History Seeker A NoBody Official Historian Founding Member

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    The owner of this club got this trap along with his 87 NEW Sporting Clays traps. He had the old ones in use for about 5 years and decided to trade for new ones.

    Makes us wonder if he got a SWEET DEAL on the Trap and Skeet traps after he purchased so many Sporting traps from them.

    Oh well, time will tell.

    Can't worry, although it sure would have been nice to drive 20 miles instead of 48 to get to the club.

    Perhaps someday things will get better...I have to look on the positive side of this.

    I didn't put much $ into it, so I guess I shouldn't complain to loudly.

    I just feel bad for the guys in my social club (Like 635G, he invested MEGA bucks) that donated so much, and got so little (so far) in return.
     
  51. 635 G

    635 G Mega Poster

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    Big discovery yesterday & today--fresh targets right out of the warehouse--OK breaks, went to a LM choke & 1 oz B&P #8 @ 1160--still good breaks

    Thanks for the insight about all the new machines--most like got that matrix @ cost, or for free
     
  52. History Seeker

    History Seeker A NoBody Official Historian Founding Member

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    This is what the donors got for their money (so far)

    Promised to be completed by October of 2019.

    These pics were taken August 20, 2020.

    Thanks 635G for sending these along. BLACK JACK AUGUST 2020.jpeg BLACK JACK 2.jpeg BLACK JACK 3.jpeg BLACK JACK 4.jpeg BLACK JACK 5.jpeg
     
  53. 635 G

    635 G Mega Poster

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    Is this just about the worst trap field out there--come on some one gotta top this
     
  54. History Seeker

    History Seeker A NoBody Official Historian Founding Member

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    Phil,

    Is that standing water and mud still there that you have to walk through to get on the pads ?

    They told us months ago that they would put in drainage, and then top it with stone or some other material.

    And no wonder the targets go all over the place. That wooden bench is probably rattling every time a target is tossed. LOL

    I never have seen a wooden work bench for a trap at any club.
     
  55. 635 G

    635 G Mega Poster

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    The water is inside of the walk ways, its a mosquito farm
     
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  56. Max Trap

    Max Trap Member Founding Member

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    The concrete Looks good. After that....not so much.
     

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